Quantcast

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
14 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Michelson, David Allen
Dear Peter,

Thank you for this and for the link. We'll follow your model. Would it be
worth submitting a feature request for a <desc> or similar generic element
to be allowed in personography for when the existing elements don't work?
Or is that a conversation that has occurred and been resolved? For what it
is worth, I'm not entirely comfortable using <note> this way because
elsewhere in my project I am using <note> for information that is
secondary or incidental (just like information one might put in a
footnote), but the information I want to encode here is parallel in
importance with what I am putting in <state> etc.

Thanks!

Dave

David A. Michelson

Assistant Professor of the History of Christianity, Divinity School
Affiliate Assistant Professor of Classics, College of Arts & Sciences

Vanderbilt University
411 21st Avenue South
Nashville, TN  37240

Phone: (615) 343-3990
Fax: (615) 343-5449

Research:www.syriaca.org <http://syriaca.org/>
     
     



Student FAQ: https://my.vanderbilt.edu/michelson/student-faq/






On 3/26/14 11:44 AM, "Peter Stadler" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>Dear Dave,
>
>you¹ve hit a long standing issue:
>http://wiki.tei-c.org/index.php/Prosopography#Mixing_Prose_and_Structure
>The proposed solution being exactly the note-workaround you came up with!
>
>Best
>Peter
>
>Am 26.03.2014 um 16:51 schrieb Michelson, David Allen
><[hidden email]>:
>
>> Dear Colleagues,
>>
>> I want to add some less structured prose in a <p>  inside a
>>personography but have run into a validation error for <p> inside a
>><person>. According to how Oxygen is using this schema
>>(http://www.tei-c.org/release/xml/tei/custom/schema/relaxng/tei_all.rng)
>><p> is allowed inside a <person> but only if there are no other elements
>>being used (such as <persName>). It will allow me to use <note> but the
>>text I want to add is not really what I would semantically consider a
>>note but rather parallel to core text with the text in the <persName>
>>and <state> elements. Is this a schema problem or should I use <note>
>>instead? Ideally I would like to use <desc> but it is not allowed.
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Dave
>
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Peter Stadler
Dear Dave,

I’m not sure whether the debate is settled or not but this issue comes up every now and then …
I did a brief search on tei sourceforge tickets but couldn’t find any request for remedying this prose vs. structure issue. Maybe now is the time?
But, allowing <desc> within <person> would be another hack — I guess what one really wants is something like a <div> within <person> (next to all the structural elements such as <persName>, <state> etc.) to allow for more structured textual content as well (e.g. <head>, <list>)
What do others think?

Regarding your reservations against <note>, I think it might help to type the notes accordingly. In the example it says <note type="bio“> which distinguishes this note from others without @type and those with a different @type value. Does that help?

All the best
Peter


Am 26.03.2014 um 17:54 schrieb Michelson, David Allen <[hidden email]>:

> Dear Peter,
>
> Thank you for this and for the link. We'll follow your model. Would it be
> worth submitting a feature request for a <desc> or similar generic element
> to be allowed in personography for when the existing elements don't work?
> Or is that a conversation that has occurred and been resolved? For what it
> is worth, I'm not entirely comfortable using <note> this way because
> elsewhere in my project I am using <note> for information that is
> secondary or incidental (just like information one might put in a
> footnote), but the information I want to encode here is parallel in
> importance with what I am putting in <state> etc.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dave
>
> David A. Michelson
>
> Assistant Professor of the History of Christianity, Divinity School
> Affiliate Assistant Professor of Classics, College of Arts & Sciences
>
> Vanderbilt University
> 411 21st Avenue South
> Nashville, TN  37240
>
> Phone: (615) 343-3990
> Fax: (615) 343-5449
>
> Research:www.syriaca.org <http://syriaca.org/>
>
>
>
>
>
> Student FAQ: https://my.vanderbilt.edu/michelson/student-faq/
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 3/26/14 11:44 AM, "Peter Stadler" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Dear Dave,
>>
>> you¹ve hit a long standing issue:
>> http://wiki.tei-c.org/index.php/Prosopography#Mixing_Prose_and_Structure
>> The proposed solution being exactly the note-workaround you came up with!
>>
>> Best
>> Peter
>>
>> Am 26.03.2014 um 16:51 schrieb Michelson, David Allen
>> <[hidden email]>:
>>
>>> Dear Colleagues,
>>>
>>> I want to add some less structured prose in a <p>  inside a
>>> personography but have run into a validation error for <p> inside a
>>> <person>. According to how Oxygen is using this schema
>>> (http://www.tei-c.org/release/xml/tei/custom/schema/relaxng/tei_all.rng)
>>> <p> is allowed inside a <person> but only if there are no other elements
>>> being used (such as <persName>). It will allow me to use <note> but the
>>> text I want to add is not really what I would semantically consider a
>>> note but rather parallel to core text with the text in the <persName>
>>> and <state> elements. Is this a schema problem or should I use <note>
>>> instead? Ideally I would like to use <desc> but it is not allowed.
>>>
>>> Any thoughts?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Dave
>>
>
>
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Sebastian Rahtz-3
The theory of <person> was that either you had paragraphs of undifferentiated prose
_or_ you could classify what you have as s state, trait or event (using generic
elements, or the common specialisations of these). I haven’t been following this
properly, but what is the info which cannot be classified under event, state or trait?
rather than just allowing <p> or <div>, do you want a fourth top-level classification?
--
Sebastian Rahtz      
Director (Research) of Academic IT
University of Oxford IT Services
13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865 283431

Não sou nada.
Nunca serei nada.
Não posso querer ser nada.
À parte isso, tenho em mim todos os sonhos do mundo.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Peter Stadler
Am 28.03.2014 um 10:14 schrieb Sebastian Rahtz <[hidden email]>:

> The theory of <person> was that either you had paragraphs of undifferentiated prose
> _or_ you could classify what you have as s state, trait or event (using generic
> elements, or the common specialisations of these). I haven’t been following this
> properly, but what is the info which cannot be classified under event, state or trait?
> rather than just allowing <p> or <div>, do you want a fourth top-level classification?
I think it’s not a classification that’s missing but just the possibility of some free text along with the structured data. Looking at http://wiki.tei-c.org/index.php/Prosopography#Mixing_Prose_and_Structure it seems the structural elements (<persName>, <birth> etc.) are kind of meta data (= normalized, used for grouping/ordering) along with some free prose, making up this biographical record. That looks like a very valid approach to me and I wonder how current personography projects are dealing with that?

Best
Peter
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Sebastian Rahtz-3
On 28 Mar 2014, at 13:12, Peter Stadler <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I think it’s not a classification that’s missing but just the possibility of some free text along with the structured data. Looking at http://wiki.tei-c.org/index.php/Prosopography#Mixing_Prose_and_Structure it seems the structural elements (<persName>, <birth> etc.) are kind of meta data (= normalized, used for grouping/ordering) along with some free prose, making up this biographical record. That looks like a very valid approach to me and I wonder how current personography projects are dealing with that?

you don’t have to use <event>, <trait>, <state> etc as containers for normalised data, they too can have paragraphs and so on. so you can use them
as section headings if you like.

then again you can put an awful lot inside a <p>, including many of the specialised elements of <person>. Sort of depends on how you
plan to use any of this stuff.

--
Sebastian Rahtz      
Director (Research) of Academic IT
University of Oxford IT Services
13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865 283431

Não sou nada.
Nunca serei nada.
Não posso querer ser nada.
À parte isso, tenho em mim todos os sonhos do mundo.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Martin Holmes
There's no easy way to write a conventional biographical essay inside
<person>, though, is there? That seems a reasonable use-case to me, and
would require divs, heads and so on.

Cheers,
Martin

On 14-03-28 06:16 AM, Sebastian Rahtz wrote:

> On 28 Mar 2014, at 13:12, Peter Stadler <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I think it’s not a classification that’s missing but just the possibility of some free text along with the structured data. Looking at http://wiki.tei-c.org/index.php/Prosopography#Mixing_Prose_and_Structure it seems the structural elements (<persName>, <birth> etc.) are kind of meta data (= normalized, used for grouping/ordering) along with some free prose, making up this biographical record. That looks like a very valid approach to me and I wonder how current personography projects are dealing with that?
>
> you don’t have to use <event>, <trait>, <state> etc as containers for normalised data, they too can have paragraphs and so on. so you can use them
> as section headings if you like.
>
> then again you can put an awful lot inside a <p>, including many of the specialised elements of <person>. Sort of depends on how you
> plan to use any of this stuff.
>
> --
> Sebastian Rahtz
> Director (Research) of Academic IT
> University of Oxford IT Services
> 13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865 283431
>
> Não sou nada.
> Nunca serei nada.
> Não posso querer ser nada.
> À parte isso, tenho em mim todos os sonhos do mundo.
>
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Sebastian Rahtz-3
On 28 Mar 2014, at 14:06, Martin Holmes <[hidden email]> wrote:

> There's no easy way to write a conventional biographical essay inside <person>, though, is there? That seems a reasonable use-case to me, and would require divs, heads and so on.

true. you’d have to use a sequence of <p>.  or <p><floatingText<<div> (only half joking).
--
Sebastian Rahtz      
Director (Research) of Academic IT
University of Oxford IT Services
13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865 283431

Não sou nada.
Nunca serei nada.
Não posso querer ser nada.
À parte isso, tenho em mim todos os sonhos do mundo.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Martin Holmes
On 14-03-28 07:16 AM, Sebastian Rahtz wrote:
>
> On 28 Mar 2014, at 14:06, Martin Holmes <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> There's no easy way to write a conventional biographical essay inside <person>, though, is there? That seems a reasonable use-case to me, and would require divs, heads and so on.
>
> true. you’d have to use a sequence of <p>.  or <p><floatingText<<div> (only half joking).

It's permissible, but it's semantically nonsensical to have a floating
text that "interrupts the text containing it" when the text containing
it has no text in it and is only there in order to be interrupted by the
<floatingText>.

I think we have a good use-case here that deserves a ticket. We'll also
have to look at <org> and <event> (but surely not <bibl>). I'd be glad
to be able to use <div> in <person>, <org> and <event>.

Cheers,
Martin

> --
> Sebastian Rahtz
> Director (Research) of Academic IT
> University of Oxford IT Services
> 13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865 283431
>
> Não sou nada.
> Nunca serei nada.
> Não posso querer ser nada.
> À parte isso, tenho em mim todos os sonhos do mundo.
>
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

James Cummings-4
On 28/03/14 14:22, Martin Holmes wrote:
> I think we have a good use-case here that deserves a ticket.
> We'll also have to look at <org> and <event> (but surely not
> <bibl>). I'd be glad to be able to use <div> in <person>, <org>
> and <event>.

To me it seems your biographical essay can either be compose of
things in state/trait as Sebastian suggests:
===
<state type="undergraduateEducation">
  <p><label>My First Year</label> I started my BA in Medieval
Studies at University of Toronto in....</p>
  <p><label>My Second Year</label> Deftly recovering from
learning Latin...</p>
</state>
===
Or indeed as a series of notes:
===
<note type="biographical">
    <label>My PhD and other Archival Studies</label>
    <p>As you can see from <ref
target="http://james.blushingbunny.net/phd.html">my PhD</ref> I
spent a lot of my time in archives...</p>
</note>
===

I'm not suggesting this whole area couldn't do with some
improvement, but maybe this should be done as part of an overall
rationalization of people/place/org/event/ and perhaps proposals
for 'object'.

-James


--
Dr James Cummings, [hidden email]
Academic IT Services, University of Oxford
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Martin Holmes
On 14-03-28 03:27 PM, James Cummings wrote:

> On 28/03/14 14:22, Martin Holmes wrote:
>> I think we have a good use-case here that deserves a ticket.
>> We'll also have to look at <org> and <event> (but surely not
>> <bibl>). I'd be glad to be able to use <div> in <person>, <org>
>> and <event>.
>
> To me it seems your biographical essay can either be compose of things
> in state/trait as Sebastian suggests:
> ===
> <state type="undergraduateEducation">
>   <p><label>My First Year</label> I started my BA in Medieval Studies at
> University of Toronto in....</p>
>   <p><label>My Second Year</label> Deftly recovering from learning
> Latin...</p>
> </state>
> ===
> Or indeed as a series of notes:
> ===
> <note type="biographical">
>     <label>My PhD and other Archival Studies</label>
>     <p>As you can see from <ref
> target="http://james.blushingbunny.net/phd.html">my PhD</ref> I spent a
> lot of my time in archives...</p>
> </note>

I'm thinking more of an ordinary biographical essay. For instance, this
bio of John Stow:

<http://mapoflondon.uvic.ca/STOW3.htm>

really ought to appear within Stow's <person> element in our
personography rather than as a separate document as it has to at the
moment. I don't think people contributing, or commissioned to write,
biographies like this would appreciate being told that their writing had
to be constrained to fit in a string of <state>s and <trait>s.

> ===
>
> I'm not suggesting this whole area couldn't do with some improvement,
> but maybe this should be done as part of an overall rationalization of
> people/place/org/event/ and perhaps proposals for 'object'.

I don't see why we wouldn't just allow <div>. This hacking away with a
series of typed notes is just ad hoc, and I don't see how it's better
than allowing a <div>, allowing writers them to structure their content
in the way that suits them best. We seem to be telling people that if
they really try they can squish their content unhandily into a set of
constraints that weren't designed for it, instead of noticing that there
is a need here, and a simple way to meet it.

Cheers,
Martin
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Lou Burnard-6
This discussion seems to be hover around what you think the basic unit
within a "personography" should be. If it is meant to hold a complete
essay with its own internal structure, front matter, bibliography, etc.
it begins to look more and more like a <tei:text> or a <tei:body> within
a <tei:group> and less and less like a <person>, as originally defined.

My belief, and I think that of the group which defined <person> and
friends was that they would not contain fine but scarcely
machine-tractable prose, but rather summarized "database-like"
information.  So that you could reliably whizz through a bunch of them
displaying the birth place of every red-haired female born between 1820
and 1890 for example.

So if there is one, I would  instead just point to the "ordinary
biographical essay",  for example by means of @ref.


On 29/03/14 00:27, Martin Holmes wrote:

> On 14-03-28 03:27 PM, James Cummings wrote:
>> On 28/03/14 14:22, Martin Holmes wrote:
>>> I think we have a good use-case here that deserves a ticket.
>>> We'll also have to look at <org> and <event> (but surely not
>>> <bibl>). I'd be glad to be able to use <div> in <person>, <org>
>>> and <event>.
>>
>> To me it seems your biographical essay can either be compose of things
>> in state/trait as Sebastian suggests:
>> ===
>> <state type="undergraduateEducation">
>>   <p><label>My First Year</label> I started my BA in Medieval Studies at
>> University of Toronto in....</p>
>>   <p><label>My Second Year</label> Deftly recovering from learning
>> Latin...</p>
>> </state>
>> ===
>> Or indeed as a series of notes:
>> ===
>> <note type="biographical">
>>     <label>My PhD and other Archival Studies</label>
>>     <p>As you can see from <ref
>> target="http://james.blushingbunny.net/phd.html">my PhD</ref> I spent a
>> lot of my time in archives...</p>
>> </note>
>
> I'm thinking more of an ordinary biographical essay. For instance,
> this bio of John Stow:
>
> <http://mapoflondon.uvic.ca/STOW3.htm>
>
> really ought to appear within Stow's <person> element in our
> personography rather than as a separate document as it has to at the
> moment. I don't think people contributing, or commissioned to write,
> biographies like this would appreciate being told that their writing
> had to be constrained to fit in a string of <state>s and <trait>s.
>
>> ===
>>
>> I'm not suggesting this whole area couldn't do with some improvement,
>> but maybe this should be done as part of an overall rationalization of
>> people/place/org/event/ and perhaps proposals for 'object'.
>
> I don't see why we wouldn't just allow <div>. This hacking away with a
> series of typed notes is just ad hoc, and I don't see how it's better
> than allowing a <div>, allowing writers them to structure their
> content in the way that suits them best. We seem to be telling people
> that if they really try they can squish their content unhandily into a
> set of constraints that weren't designed for it, instead of noticing
> that there is a need here, and a simple way to meet it.
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Martin Mueller
I've followed this discussion from a distance, reluctant to chime in
because it's way above my technical paygrade. But for what it's worth,
I've had exactly the feeling that Lou expressed eloquently in his recent
post. Essay-lik stuff and database-like stuff don't mix very well, and if
you do mix them you may create more problems for users than by keeping
them separate in the first place.

Martin Mueller
Professor emeritus of English and Classics
Northwestern University




On 3/29/14 9:36 AM, "Lou Burnard" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>This discussion seems to be hover around what you think the basic unit
>within a "personography" should be. If it is meant to hold a complete
>essay with its own internal structure, front matter, bibliography, etc.
>it begins to look more and more like a <tei:text> or a <tei:body> within
>a <tei:group> and less and less like a <person>, as originally defined.
>
>My belief, and I think that of the group which defined <person> and
>friends was that they would not contain fine but scarcely
>machine-tractable prose, but rather summarized "database-like"
>information.  So that you could reliably whizz through a bunch of them
>displaying the birth place of every red-haired female born between 1820
>and 1890 for example.
>
>So if there is one, I would  instead just point to the "ordinary
>biographical essay",  for example by means of @ref.
>
>
>On 29/03/14 00:27, Martin Holmes wrote:
>> On 14-03-28 03:27 PM, James Cummings wrote:
>>> On 28/03/14 14:22, Martin Holmes wrote:
>>>> I think we have a good use-case here that deserves a ticket.
>>>> We'll also have to look at <org> and <event> (but surely not
>>>> <bibl>). I'd be glad to be able to use <div> in <person>, <org>
>>>> and <event>.
>>>
>>> To me it seems your biographical essay can either be compose of things
>>> in state/trait as Sebastian suggests:
>>> ===
>>> <state type="undergraduateEducation">
>>>   <p><label>My First Year</label> I started my BA in Medieval Studies
>>>at
>>> University of Toronto in....</p>
>>>   <p><label>My Second Year</label> Deftly recovering from learning
>>> Latin...</p>
>>> </state>
>>> ===
>>> Or indeed as a series of notes:
>>> ===
>>> <note type="biographical">
>>>     <label>My PhD and other Archival Studies</label>
>>>     <p>As you can see from <ref
>>> target="http://james.blushingbunny.net/phd.html">my PhD</ref> I spent a
>>> lot of my time in archives...</p>
>>> </note>
>>
>> I'm thinking more of an ordinary biographical essay. For instance,
>> this bio of John Stow:
>>
>> <http://mapoflondon.uvic.ca/STOW3.htm>
>>
>> really ought to appear within Stow's <person> element in our
>> personography rather than as a separate document as it has to at the
>> moment. I don't think people contributing, or commissioned to write,
>> biographies like this would appreciate being told that their writing
>> had to be constrained to fit in a string of <state>s and <trait>s.
>>
>>> ===
>>>
>>> I'm not suggesting this whole area couldn't do with some improvement,
>>> but maybe this should be done as part of an overall rationalization of
>>> people/place/org/event/ and perhaps proposals for 'object'.
>>
>> I don't see why we wouldn't just allow <div>. This hacking away with a
>> series of typed notes is just ad hoc, and I don't see how it's better
>> than allowing a <div>, allowing writers them to structure their
>> content in the way that suits them best. We seem to be telling people
>> that if they really try they can squish their content unhandily into a
>> set of constraints that weren't designed for it, instead of noticing
>> that there is a need here, and a simple way to meet it.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Martin
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Sebastian Rahtz-3
In reply to this post by Martin Holmes
On 29 Mar 2014, at 00:27, Martin Holmes <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I don't see why we wouldn't just allow <div>. This hacking away with a series of typed notes is just ad hoc, and I don't see how it's better than allowing a <div>, allowing writers them to structure their content in the way that suits them best. We seem to be telling people that if they really try they can squish their content unhandily into a set of constraints that weren't designed for it, instead of noticing that there is a need here, and a simple way to meet it.

The same argument could be made for many another TEI element which was designed for structured content, and which can be classified as metadata.

I am torn. Half of me agrees with Lou, that biographical essays simply belong in their own context, because <person> is designed to
manage the traditional prosopographical database; on the other hand,  the search for left-handed female sculptors born after 1953 is not hampered by
the presence of the essay, since we will ignore it alongside the reckless <p>s that are put in now. Of course, the essay which says
“born in 1955, she followed the family tradition of becoming a sculptor, uninhibited by her refusal to use her right hand” is not going to yield any
results.

you almost need an <essay> element, which _is_ a bit like <floatIngText>, and which can appear in any of these data contexts.
--
Sebastian Rahtz      
Director (Research) of Academic IT
University of Oxford IT Services
13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865 283431

Não sou nada.
Nunca serei nada.
Não posso querer ser nada.
À parte isso, tenho em mim todos os sonhos do mundo.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|  
Report Content as Inappropriate

Re: <p> inside a <person>?

Peter Stadler
ok, after two days I’m still in favor of remedying the prose-structure-antagonism *within* the content model of person, so added a ticket to the sourceforge tracker: https://sourceforge.net/p/tei/feature-requests/503/

Best
Peter

Am 30.03.2014 um 12:19 schrieb Sebastian Rahtz <[hidden email]>:

> On 29 Mar 2014, at 00:27, Martin Holmes <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I don't see why we wouldn't just allow <div>. This hacking away with a series of typed notes is just ad hoc, and I don't see how it's better than allowing a <div>, allowing writers them to structure their content in the way that suits them best. We seem to be telling people that if they really try they can squish their content unhandily into a set of constraints that weren't designed for it, instead of noticing that there is a need here, and a simple way to meet it.
>
> The same argument could be made for many another TEI element which was designed for structured content, and which can be classified as metadata.
>
> I am torn. Half of me agrees with Lou, that biographical essays simply belong in their own context, because <person> is designed to
> manage the traditional prosopographical database; on the other hand,  the search for left-handed female sculptors born after 1953 is not hampered by
> the presence of the essay, since we will ignore it alongside the reckless <p>s that are put in now. Of course, the essay which says
> “born in 1955, she followed the family tradition of becoming a sculptor, uninhibited by her refusal to use her right hand” is not going to yield any
> results.
>
> you almost need an <essay> element, which _is_ a bit like <floatIngText>, and which can appear in any of these data contexts.
> --
> Sebastian Rahtz      
> Director (Research) of Academic IT
> University of Oxford IT Services
> 13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865 283431
>
> Não sou nada.
> Nunca serei nada.
> Não posso querer ser nada.
> À parte isso, tenho em mim todos os sonhos do mundo.
Loading...